After my business failure, can I get hired?

On May 17, 2021
After my business failure, can I get hired?

Question

Four years ago, three co-workers and I bought the software development firm we worked for, but business has slowed down and the company is failing. My 10 years working for this previously successful company is the only major work experience I have. How will an employer view a business failure? How can I sell my employment qualifications even though my own business isn’t succeeding?

Nick’s Reply

Not a lot of Ask The Headhunter readers have owned a business, but this is an interesting question because at its heart it applies to anyone who is trying to make a job or career change after a failure.

The answer is all about how to shift from failure in one area of your work life to success in another. So whether you’re a failed business owner, or a manager who couldn’t really manage looking to return to a staff job, or a widget designer who tried and failed at sales and is ready to go back to making widgets, please read on.

Business failure is not professional failure

Don’t confuse your technical skills with your ability to manage a business. Failing at running a business doesn’t mean you’re a failure professionally. In your interviews, focus on what you do best and pursue jobs along the right lines. This applies to anyone — not just programmers or technical folks. Don’t get bogged down in your failure. If you tried and failed at management, remember that you still have a solid record as a software developer.

Business failure is common

What if the business you ran was a consulting business? Can a self-employed consultant get a regular job?
In a world where everyone wants to be an entrepreneur, few actually try, and most who do try, fail. Many of the employers you interview with will understand that. Our business culture has never been so comfortable with the idea of people trying and failing to run their own businesses (or trying and failing to pursue a new career). So, don’t expect negative reactions.

Of course, you will get some knocks for your failure, but take that in stride. Be careful to present your failure with candor and good humor.

Business failure is not the question

Remember that the key questions the employer has for you are not about how you’d run a business. They’re about whether you can do the job at hand. So turn the conversation to your prowess as a developer. Show how you will use your skills and experience for the employer’s benefit in software development.

Another key question will have to do with your work habits. Employers sometimes presume that a business owner will find it difficult to take direction and to be managed. It’s up to you to demonstrate that you can work for the manager and be a good team member.

If you’re asked why you’re leaving your own business, just ‘fess up.

How to Say It:

  1. I’m not a great business owner, but I am a great software developer. (Or, I wasn’t great at selling widgets, but I am great at building them.)
  2. My technical talents helped make the business successful before I bought it.
  3. I no longer have aspirations about running my own business. I got that out of my system. I want to be part of a team that works well together.
  4. My goal now is to be the best software developer I can be — and to contribute to my team’s success.
  5. Now that I’ve learned designing software and producing great code are my strong skills, I’m all the more focused on doing exactly that.

When meeting with a prospective employer, demonstrate that you understand the difference between what you failed at, and what you want to do next. Don’t be afraid to be blunt with an employer.

How to Say It

“You focus on running the business; I’ll focus on delivering the best product anyone could produce.”

(Or selling the most product, or running the most efficient production department, or producing the most effective marketing materials.)

Convey that message as honestly and compellingly as you can, and I think you’ll get a good reception. Stick to talking about the job you’re going after. Focus on the work to be done, not on your business failure. That’s how you let the employer know you’re not stuck in the past. If you start getting defensive (or too detailed) about your old business, you’ll put the employer off. (Check these two magic interview questions you can use to put the interview on track.)

We all have failures, but the smartest people reveal their strengths when they admit their failures. They show they’ve learned from the experience. They stop talking about the failure and eagerly move on to the next challenge.

I wish you the best.

Have you ever run a business that failed? What was it like getting a job? How would you advise this reader? What would worry you about hiring someone whose business failed? What other kinds of failure have you recovered from?

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The labor shortage is really a pay shortage

On May 10, 2021
The labor shortage is really a pay shortage

Question

labor shortageI bookmarked an article you wrote a few years ago: B.S. on the jobs numbers euphoria. Jobs numbers are the #1 story again: 260,000 jobs added versus over a million the economists predicted would be a slam-dunk! Is that a labor shortage or job shortage? Maybe a pay shortage? Once again they’re blaming us, people looking for jobs! We’re not educated enough or skilled enough or willing to go on goose-chase interviews recruiters e-mail us about. Now we’re deadbeats living on rich unemployment supplements. Who needs to work, right? I DO!

Nick’s Reply

The burning question in the news today is, why are so many employers unable to fill jobs? Is it because, as some claim, recipients of pandemic relief benefits would rather “collect” than work? Is it because people who want to work are afraid to, because the virus is still a risk? Or, as others say, are working women staying home because someone has to watch the kids while schools are closed?

Labor shortage or shortage of pay?

I’m no economist — hell, they just got the “jobs added” numbers wrong by about a factor of 4! — but based on what my readers tell me and on what I see, the answer is simple. Employers don’t want to pay market wages and salaries to attract workers for jobs they say are so important to fill.

I believe low pay most readily explains much of the inability to hire. There’s no labor shortage. It’s a supply and demand problem. And many employers are running scared because they don’t know what they’re doing. (A more cynical view is that they’re just greedy.)

Let’s look at the contradictions.

Business to labor: You’re deadbeats

On one hand, unemployment has remained at around 6.1% — still very high. According to Neel Kashkari, President of the Federal Reserve Bank of Minneapolis, between 8 and 10 million people who want to work can’t find jobs. He also suggests it’s unreasonable to expect the effects of the pandemic are over. He says things are getting better, but it’s going to be months before we see substantial improvements. Judging from the numbers, we don’t need an economist to tell us the problem is a shortage of jobs — jobs that pay enough to attract workers.

The U.S. Chamber of Commerce, on another hand, suggests those 8 to 10 million are deadbeats living large on pandemic relief benefits. In fact, the Chamber is so sure it can find jobs for all those people that it has demanded the extra $300 per week unemployment benefits be cut immediately. Says the Chamber: “It’s giving some recipients less incentive to look for work.”

Labor to economists: You’re stupid

Now we need a third hand to juggle the facts. On May 6 Barrons proclaimed, Get Ready for a Blockbuster Jobs Report of 1 Million or More. Oops! The next day, the Bureau of Labor Statistics revealed that business added just 266,000 jobs last month — not over a million like economists confidently predicted. So, where are “all those jobs” employers can’t fill and that you should be applying for?

Who’s stupid about jobs?

It seems pretty simple: The real disincentive to look for work is that there aren’t enough jobs since the pandemic started! Employers who are trying to get back up and running think they can keep pay low because millions are “looking” — but job seekers aren’t buying low wages. They’re not stupid.

I’m sure some jobs are going begging, but lots of unemployed workers are refusing to beg. Let’s look at some examples.

Who’s competitive?

New Jersey’s Star-Ledger reports:

“Mike Jurusz is worried about the summer. As owner and executive chef at Chef Mike’s Atlantic Bar & Grill in South Seaside Park, [a New Jersey beach town] he said he can’t find anyone to hire. He blames his staffing troubles on expanded unemployment benefits and stimulus payments. ‘It’s impossible to get help right now,’ he says.”

Here’s where facts run into overwrought explanations — and perhaps into poor business decisions. (By the way, I don’t pick on Jurusz or anyone else except that they’re a handy examples provided by the press. I don’t know him or his business other than what I’ve read.)

Jurusz doesn’t reveal what he’s paying to fill those jobs. Yet he complains that “businesses that raise their hourly wage to entice workers make it harder for others to compete.”

Now get this.

“‘We are going to have to be forced to pay people who are not worth what they should be getting,’ Jurusz said. ‘That will increase my labor costs, then we have to increase the pricing because we have to stay in business. You’re going to see $30 plain pizzas and $35 subs.”

What I hear is a small businessman running scared. I feel for anyone facing business challenges, but having to make payroll is going to put some businesses out of business. Welcome to the new economy.

Do employers really need to pay more?

They do if you listen to retailers, who say that to compete with Amazon, which pays more than $15 an hour to snatch up available labor, they, too, have to raise wages. While some restaurateurs can’t beat that kind of job offer, Amit Patel, a snack-food manufacturer, also in New Jersey, said to the Star-Ledger:

“Do you think an employee would want to work at $10 or $11 an hour in a COVID environment when they have no job security, no benefits? People are realizing their worth is a lot more.”

Patel has raised the wages his company pays by 30% since the start of the pandemic.

Smart employers are busy hiring

Another New Jersey restaurant owner in the same Star-Ledger article, Tim McLoone, said he doesn’t blame the hiring challenges on people who don’t want to work.

“It’s offensive to demonize one group of people,” he said. “There’s no question that unemployment has contributed to the diminishment of the labor market, but it’s not like they’re staying home to watch The Price Is Right and they don’t want to work.”

McLoone recently increased hourly wages to $15 for employees who don’t receive tips. Got a labor shortage? Grow up and pay what you have to. It’s called a market.

The economists who got it wrong are trying to scapegoat working stiffs who know from experience that employers aren’t adding jobs at the rates economists claim. All those job postings on Indeed and LinkedIn include a lot of dupes and garbage. They know many employers aren’t offering wages worth working for — just ask them what the recruiters are pitching. Anyone that planned on over a million new jobs got suckered by wishful economic predictions.

It’s a new labor market

Blaming the pandemic relief program is a cheap shot designed to deflect responsibility from employers large and small that have been profiting enormously for a decade without sharing with their employees. You can look up the average disparities between executive pay and employees somewhere else. I’m frankly sick of looking at the numbers. If anything, the relief benefits are balancing the scales a bit.

But there’s another part to this. Some of those unemployed workers have wised up to the game. They’ve gotten smarter than employers and economists. They know they’re worth more and won’t work for less.

In other words, it seems employers that respect the law of supply and demand offer higher wages — and they can afford to. Just look at Amazon. If your business model doesn’t permit you to pay enough to attract good workers in a highly competitive market, maybe that says you can’t compete. Maybe you shouldn’t be in business. It’s a new labor market.

The “jobs numbers” suggest that many of the millions of unemployed who want to work are wise to wait until healthy businesses offer them higher pay. The pandemic benefits make it a bit easier to hold out, but it’s the choice I’d make even without the benefits.

The noise continues

I’m not an economist or a labor market expert. But it’s not hard to see what’s going on. I can interpret what I see pretty easily by looking where the big money is telling me not to look — past the noise.

For example, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce says:

“Based on the Chamber’s analysis, the $300 benefit results in approximately one in four recipients taking home more in unemployment than they earned working.”

The Chamber is bragging that its members pay less than unemployment does? If employers really believe Uncle Sam is out-bidding them and keeping labor on the sidelines, those employers are simply uncompetitive.

The Washington Post reports that:

“Some businesses have been complaining to the White House and lawmakers that they are having a hard time recruiting workers, particularly for low-wage, hourly jobs.”

But are these businesses offering more competitive wages?

“Average hourly wages rose about 21 cents across the country, data that the BLS suggested reflected increasing demand for labor.”

21 cents? Not only are these clowns not competing with Amazon and Tim McLoone, they aren’t even anteing up to stay in the game. The Star-Ledger reports that Morey’s Piers, operator of amusement parks in New Jersey, has boosted pay 25% to $15 an hour to fill 1,500 seasonal jobs this summer. There are those that get it and those that don’t.

Labor shortage: Last thing employers want to do is raise wages

This isn’t complicated, unless you listen to economists and greedy employers. Yes, greedy employers. I’m not even going to offer you links to articles about massive profits, stock prices and executive pay that has dwarfed employee pay in the past several years. I’ll just point out that the business world’s alpha dog, Jeff Bezos, has allowed that he understands and supports tax hikes on corporations and the very wealthy — and Amazon has boosted employee pay. The jig is up. It’s time for business to pay up.

I’ll leave you with two brief audio segments from a Bloomberg Radio interview with Fed President Neel Kashkari. (I’ve added emphasis.) This guy gets it and he’s not afraid to say it.

 

Highlight:

“I hope we see employers step up. That was one of the things that was extraordinary about the last recovery. It took 10 years to return to something like maximum employment, and I’m not even sure that we quite got there before the pandemic hit. And it was only in the last few years of the recovery, after many years of businesses complaining that they couldn’t find workers, only in the last couple of years that we finally saw wages start to pick up, especially for those lowest income workers. Businesses will do anything they can do to try to meet their labor needs — and the last thing they want to do is raise wages.”

 

 

Highlight:

“We have the tools to tighten monetary policy to keep inflation in check. I’m not worried about that. What I am worried about is not having another 10-year recovery for our labor market. That’s devastating to millions of Americans and we need to put them back to work much more quickly.”

 

Yah, I know it’s more complicated, but this Fed president has the candor to break it down so it’s simple. It’s time for politicians, employers and government to grow up. The sooner the economy faces it, the better. To get businesses back up and running post-COVID, companies have to pay more. Not because of COVID. Because it’s long overdue. The virus has just served to remind people that life is short — and they’re not willing to work for less.

Those employers that cry higher wages will put them out of business must realize that offering low pay will probably put them out of business.

What do you see when you step back from the “labor shortage?” What’s the fix? Have you stayed out of the job market because employers are low-balling you? Have you found competitive employers who pay well? How can an unemployed job seeker find a good-paying job today?

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Does severance pay make sense?

On May 3, 2021
Does severance pay make sense?

Question

I’m curious about how companies determine severance pay packages. I assume there are state laws that dictate minimum severance amounts, or it seems there would be no severance packages at all. But some companies give more than that. One recently gave its laid-off employees six months of severance, which is very generous in these times. But why? While that’s good news for the employees, why would a company or its shareholders want to give more than it has to?

I’m also curious why upper management receives more severance. I understand that CEOs and their echelon often have prearranged golden parachutes. But managers without such agreements or contracts sometimes get more severance (in terms of weeks of pay) than others. Again, I don’t understand the benefit to the company. What’s the deal?

Nick’s Reply

I hope some of the HR members of our community will chime in here. I’m sure they’ve got some good insights on this (and even better stories.) You’re asking a lot of questions, but not for advice. I’ll try to illuminate what I can, and I’ll offer some advice at the end anyway!

Why severance pay?

I don’t believe there are any states in the U.S. that require severance pay to be paid to a departing employee. For the most part severance is a company’s prerogative and an employee’s privilege — it’s not a right.

severance payHowever, severance always serves the employer — it’s not a gift. It’s always a form of handcuffs because the agreement you sign will tie your hands in some ways.

One of the main reasons companies offer severance is to avoid future legal problems. A company will offer severance in exchange for you signing an NDA or a non-disparagement agreement, or a release from any further liability to you. Call it a bribe, but it often works. Sometimes the severance offer is very aggressive: “We’re willing to drop big bucks on you, but you have to agree so some pretty unsavory terms.” The more they offer, the harder it is to say no.

While extravagant severance deals sometimes border on criminal, they’re usually negotiated at the time of hire. The employer makes the deal with eyes open. So what might seem irrational is a pragmatic way for a company to convince a desirable job candidate to accept an offer.

Severance pay is practical

It’s also a practical thing to do. When used properly and for the right reasons, severance is a company’s way of parting on good terms, especially when it’s the company that terminates the relationship. (Companies rarely pay severance when you decide to leave.) It’s the complement to an employee giving two weeks’ notice before quitting.

Negotiating a job offer? Don’t miss:
Employment Contracts: Everyone needs promise protection
While we all know parting company can be a fraught – even nasty – experience, it should be civilized, and we should try to respect one another’s needs when we can. We don’t want to leave each other in the lurch. Of course, that’s the best case.

Often, severance is paid to ensure a smooth transition. The departing employee getting a nice package is more apt to leave their workflow in good condition for their replacement — and perhaps to take a call or two with questions even after they’re gone.

Severance is often based on how badly the company needs the employee’s services between now and the termination or layoff date. For example, a company might need a manager to stick around until the last employee is laid off and until the last project is wrapped up. In exchange for having less time to look for a new job, the manager accepts more severance.

It’s also good public relations

Why do some companies pay more severance than others? They’re smart. When a worker leaves a company with a nice package, he or she is more inclined to speak favorably of it to other workers, probably for years to come. That’s a competitive edge. Good public relations are no accident, and they don’t require government incentives. A company that wants a good reputation works hard at burnishing its image as a responsible employer. Severance is part of that strategy.

Managers often get better packages than staff for a few reasons. To start, their compensation is higher and severance formulas are usually rational (if not outlandish). They’re based on compensation and time served at the company. Higher compensation usually means more severance.

Managers also belong to a club of sorts, and they tend to take care of each other because they never know when they’ll run into one another again. Today’s department manager might one day hire his or her old boss, and what goes around comes around. So it’s not just public relations. It’s also professional relations.

Some advice

And this brings us around to my advice. There’s a lesson you should take from all this: Not everyone gets a chance to negotiate a severance deal. But everyone should try. You might ask yourself, what will this company need from me when I depart, and what will they not want me to do? (For example, share something I learned at the job.) What’s that worth?

Don’t assume only executives or managers get severance pay. When you negotiate your next job offer, ask about severance. If you believe your job is important to the employer, you might even negotiate aggressively. Make it part of your written offer. Then you might not be so irritated about the severance deals others get!

To give you a head start on dealing with severance deals, I’ve included a special News I want you to use item this week. Don’t miss Hack that severance agreement! You’ll learn not just what you might ask for, but what to avoid agreeing to.

Do you have a good severance agreement with your employer? Are you in management? How did you negotiate your severance deal? Do you bring severance up when negotiating a job offer?

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Control what your professional references will say

On April 26, 2021
Control what your professional references will say

Question

professional referencesI’m in the final phase of getting a job offer I really want. They already told me what the offer is, but they need to check my references before they deliver it in writing. I know my professional references are good but how do I really know what a former boss or colleague is going to say? Your advice will affect whose names I give out. Thanks.

Nick’s Reply

You know what your references will say by controlling it in advance. You’d never go to a job interview without being prepared. So, why would you let your references talk to an employer without preparing them?

Having checked thousands of references — always on the phone, never via e-mail — I’ve found that most are bleah at best. A bad reference is rare and a superlative reference is uncommon. But without a lot of prompting from me, a candidate’s references usually have little to say. They’re unprepared.

How your professional references can hurt you

This is bad for two reasons. First, an unprepared reference comes off as unenthusiastic. Enthusiasm about the candidate in question is paramount in a reference check. An awful lot of insight and information about a candidate is folded into the way their references speak about them.

Second, uninspiring comments about a candidate can count against them; for example, if other problems arise with your candidacy, there needs to be some countervailing fervor. If a reference can’t speak enthusiastically about the candidate, I’ll go with a candidate whose references can.

Here’s the tragedy. People get rated #2 or #3 in highly competitive interviews not because they lack necessary qualities, but because their references aren’t prepared to deliver clear, compelling opinions about them.

Control what your references will say about you

Don’t lose a job offer because of your references. To pull this off, you must select professional references that will launch you into the new job you want. How do you choose whose names to submit? Well, you need to know what they’re going to say, right?

The robo-reference problem
What if an employer wants your references to fill out online forms or to talk to a robot, rather than take a call? See Before you risk your references.
The best way to control what your references will say is to coach them!

I’m going to offer a few observations and suggestions about how to control — yes, control — your references. I don’t mean manipulate; I mean prepare them to deliver opinions and comments that will make an employer want to hire you. There is nothing dishonest or underhanded about this. We’re going to exploit some simple laws of psychology. We’re going to prepare your references to do their best for you.

How to prepare your professional references

1. Call them
When you need a former boss or co-worker to step up and deliver a warm, enthusiastic endorsement for you, don’t make the request via e-mail. Make your request just as warm and personal. Use the phone. This is critical because only a conversation will enable you to control what they say. Of course, you must start by asking if they’d be willing to give you a reference. If they agree, tell them who is going to call, and very briefly outline the job you want.

2. Help them remember
When an employer calls, most references are taken by surprise. They’re in the middle of something else. They’re not thinking about you and your time working together. That’s why you need to call them first, to remind them what made you a great employee and to prepare them about the job you want. (If you have a solid relationship with the person, this is where you can disclose what you’re doing. “To be frank, I know how busy you are. I figured that recapping our work together might help with the reference call.”)

3. Say it out loud
Here’s a fun fact from the world of cognitive psychology: People remember better when they write something down or say it out loud first. More important, in this case, is that people also tend to repeat what they’ve already said or heard. So, when you ask your former co-worker or boss to serve as a  reference, recount your past experiences together out loud. Trust me: They are then likely to parrot the words from your conversation to the employer that calls them. This is how you’ll know in advance what they are most likely to say.

4. Recount successes
Ask if they remember a successful project you worked on together. Say this: “I know we faced some challenges, but I’m proud of how we did X, Y and Z.” Ask what they remember about it. Guide your discussion so they will recount out loud (a) what your contribution was, (b) how you did it, and (c) how it paid off. Let them say it so they can hear it.

5. Map skills
Briefly suggest which of your skills (that were so valuable to your old employer) will map onto the new job you want, and how they will pay off to the new employer. Then…

6. Ask for advice and insight
Briefly describe the challenges of the new job. Ask your colleague’s advice about which of your skills might contribute to your success. Ask how they suggest you should approach it.

7. What did you do best?
Help the colleague express out loud what you did best at your old job.

8. What would make you a better worker?
Ask this: “If you could give my new boss some advice about how to help me perform better, what would you say?” (This is a subtle way of influencing the answer to the infamous reference checker’s question, “What are this person’s weaknesses?”)

Prepare your professional references

As we’ve said, you prepare for your job interviews, so prepare your references for a reference call. People parrot what they hear. Help your references parrot themselves. Gently make them say it. Helping them say it out loud to you helps them remember it for the reference call.

Don’t expect to do everything I’ve suggested! Just what you’re most comfortable with and what there’s time for. And of course, there is no guarantee any of this will work — but it’s the best way I know to have some measure of control over your references. Don’t forget to thank your reference for their kind help, for taking a trip down memory lane, and for taking time to speak with who you hope will be your next employer.

Finally, say this: “If I can ever return the favor, don’t hesitate to call me.”

Objections?

Now I’ll try to anticipate a couple of objections you may have:

“I don’t feel comfortable doing this.”

Then why submit the person as a reference? Please think about it. If a former colleague is not likely to take a few minutes to discuss your experiences working together, do you really think they’ll help you get hired?

“I don’t have any references I know well enough to do what you suggest!”

This is a wake-up call. Start cultivating colleagues now, so you can count on their references in the future!

Do you have references you can count on? How did you cultivate them? How do you avoid awkwardness when requesting a reference? Has a reference ever torpedoed a job opportunity for you? Has a reference ever clearly tipped the scales to help you get hired? What tips would you add to the list above?

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Hired, quit 2 days later. Would you rehire?

On April 19, 2021
Hired, quit 2 days later. Would you rehire?

Question

rehireA new hire in my department resigned after two days at work. He took a counter-offer at his previous company where he had been 22 years. I know you advise against accepting counter-offers because it “marks” you as a wayward employee that will likely be replaced soon. My manager says that he burned bridges with our company and we would not interview or rehire him. My take? Employment at-will rules the day, so I would have no problem, but it’s not my decision. Should he be “marked” here, too, because he quit? How would you advise my company if he were to apply again in the future?

Nick’s Reply

You raise a good, new question, even if it’s hypothetical. How should your company, which he jilted, view this if the errant new hire returns and applies for a job again later? I think the answer lies in another question: What’s the a difference between an employee that quits 22 years after they were hired, and one that quits after just two days on the job?

Why rehire?

To some extent, I agree with your boss. Why take another chance on a new hire who quits to go back to the old employer? Again, it depends on the circumstances. It’s important to remember that hiring and getting hired is a business and financial decision. Certainly, other factors matter. But in the end, that new hire had to consider several things, including leaving your boss in the lurch and hurting his own reputation.

If he revealed a callous disregard for your company, was rude or manipulative and dishonest, then I’d never rehire him.

Why rehire someone who walked out on you? Well, why did his old company take him back? You do it if they are forthright, very good at their work and honest. I would seriously consider hiring him again if only because my company needs good workers. So I agree with you. Hiring him back would be a business and financial decision. Isn’t that why his original employer made a counter-offer to a “disloyal” employee who “walked out on them” after years instead of days? (Of course, it is possible he’s now “marked” — we may never know!)

Why do we hire?

The unknown is whether he might disappear again. It depends entirely on the individual and the circumstances. If this sounds wishy-washy, consider an extreme case. Suppose this guy was not very pleasant, but your company desperately needed his skills. You might hire him anyway. Sometimes we have to swallow hard, ignore the difficulties, and make the purely pragmatic decision. We don’t hire because we want to be happy. We hire because we need good workers who can get the job done.

The bottom line is, if the guy was worth hiring the first time, he’d probably be worth hiring again. Of course, it would be wise to have a heart-to-heart about “Are you going to do it again?” Perhaps his old employer asked this question, too.

Sometimes we make decisions in business that hurt others, like laying someone off or quitting our job. We’re inflicting pain unintentionally but perhaps unavoidably. Each person and company must do what’s best for them. So, I’ll reiterate the puzzle I already posed: Does it make a difference when someone quits after two days or 22 years?

Where is the line?

Is a no-rehire policy prudent? If this individual were to apply again for a job at your company in the future, I agree with you that they should consider him. Since your boss hired him once, I assume your boss has judged him to be good at his job and pleasant enough to work with. While this episode has been inconvenient and has cost your company time and money, that’s business. If your company writes people off as “no rehire” because they quit, it’s going to miss out on some great talent in a highly competitive economy. And meanwhile, the work is not getting done. So where is the line?

Have you ever started a new job only to accept a counter-offer and quit? What’s your company’s policy on re-hiring employees that quit? Would you re-apply at a company you quit after just two days? Where is the line?

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Questions recruiters ask that you shouldn’t answer

On April 12, 2021
Questions recruiters ask that you shouldn’t answer

Question

questions recruiters askI’d like to ask you about questions recruiters ask. I had a call with a recruiter for a well-known recruiting firm. It was a “get to know you so we can potentially work together in the future” type of call. During our conversation the recruiter asks where my family lives. I tell her some of my family is in X state and my husband’s family is in Y. That being said, I am open to various locations. Then she asks where my parents live. In the moment I am thinking, does she really need this info? But I tell her they are not in the U.S. Then she asks, “So where are they?”

Am I obliged to answer this question, especially when it comes across as pushy? I want to give her the benefit of the doubt that she is looking out for me but it made me uncomfortable. How should I handle it in the future?

Nick’s Reply

You are never obliged to answer any questions that make you feel uncomfortable. And I agree — something’s up with that recruiter. I cannot imagine how your parents’ place of residence would affect your job.

How will that help you place me?

There is no reason to not ask why she needs to know. You can reject any question you feel is too personal, illegal, or indicative of bias — especially if the recruiter offers no explanation about how that information will help her to place you.

And that’s the key point about any questions recruiters ask: How will that help you place me? That’s a perfectly professional way to challenge them without being confrontational.

I wouldn’t bother bringing it up again because it will serve no purpose. If she asks another such question, that’s when you should state your position. (Here’s a batch of interview questions that are illegal.)

What’s she look like?

As a headhunter, I’ve encountered questions that have been surprising. Some were questions clients asked me; others were questions employers asked job candidates. Here are some examples.

A new client asked about a candidate I had presented: “We looked her up on LinkedIn but her profile has no photo. Can you have her add her photo?”

When I inquired about the reason they wanted to see a photo, they said they just wanted to get a look at her. I fired the client. A photo and what she looked like were irrelevant. (Then there’s this stupid interview question to ask a woman.)

Man to man?

After two rounds of interviews went very well, the HR recruiter wanted to discuss the Quality Assurance Engineer I sent him.

“Is he, uh, you know?”

“No, I don’t know,” I responded. “Is he what?”

“You must have noticed. You know. How do I put this. The other guys on the team here prefer to work with, you know, a man’s man.”

“A what?”

“You know, doesn’t the guy seem effeminate to you?”

Oh, I suddenly knew. His company missed out on a great Q.A. engineer that day, and I fired the client.

Can you steal?

A senior executive came to me for coaching while she navigated a complex interviewing process at a company she really wanted to work for. The company was a direct competitor of her current employer. At the second interview they asked her to bring certain materials to her third interview: her current company’s price lists for customers the new company competed for.

She felt she had no choice but was worried about the ethical problem. I told her not to do it. She was relieved because she agreed. I suggested she tell them she would no more reveal her current employer’s confidential data than she would reveal the new company’s data to her next employer. To her surprise, they hired her anyway and never brought up the subject again.

I’ve got more: The high-tech employer that wanted to know “What kind of accent is that?”  The retailer who wanted a new HR executive but only females need apply. I’ll close with these two really insulting interview questions. Now let’s hear yours.

What inappropriate questions have recruiters and employers asked you? How did you handle it? What questions have you answered that you wish you hadn’t? What was the outcome?

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Networking Magic: Help someone get a job

On April 5, 2021
Networking Magic: Help someone get a job

Question

help someone get a jobI’m a regular reader. Most of the articles are about “How do I get a job?” How about one that talks about “How do I help someone else get a job?”

This just happened last week. I told a former co-worker that I would give him a recommendation. I was happy to do it because the company we worked at was bad, and he was a very professional guy. He told me a staffing firm would be calling, so I was ready.

The young recruiter asked me some typical questions like, “What tools does he use? Does he use Power BI?” These questions were mostly irrelevant to the job requirements. The recruiter was just checking off boxes on a form.

I interrupted. “What you need to know is that this guy can go into any job, figure out what needs to be done, and do it without being told. I saw it.”

The recruiter said, “Really? Oh, hold on, let me write that down.” I took him off his script, and I think I helped my guy out.

Because isn’t that what every staffing service wants? Someone who just walks in, does the job, and makes the staffing service look good? A recruiter asking for a recommendation may not realize it, so you just have to work with them a little to make them realize it.

I’ll bet the readership could come up with lots of examples of how to help someone else out.

Nick’s Reply

When I suggest to people that they turn to their professional contacts when they want a new job, many lament that they don’t really have any. “I don’t know anybody!” You just showed how to make such contacts in what might be viewed as an usual way: by helping someone else get a job.

Personal referrals start with you

We all know that most jobs are found and filled through personal contacts. Yet we spend too much if not most of our time applying online via forms and clicks. Or, we wait for recruiters to spam us with unspecified “opportunities.” That’s a million miles from the nearest personal contact — and the nearest good job.

I learned long ago that even in the most volatile markets the best companies are quietly hiring — through personal referrals. But people misunderstand the personal referral. It doesn’t mean taking your friend’s resume to your HR department or passing it to your boss. It means sticking your neck out for someone like you’d want them to do for you.

Break the script when making a recommendation

Your story is not unusual but it’s instructive because you took the initiative to do more than answer a recruiter’s questions. You broke the recruiter’s standard script. Those scripts are designed to gather data points the company can process to judge whether a person is worth interviewing and hiring.

But you did the “processing” for the recruiter. You interrupted and gave the recruiter the answer: “This person is worth hiring. I saw it with my own eyes.” You made your recommendation personal to that recruiter. You stuck your neck out. That moved your buddy to the front of the hiring line.

Tap into a new network: help someone get a job

Sometimes we get so wrapped up trying to get ourselves a job that we forget where jobs come from: one another. Applying to a job posted online does not produce good will, or reciprocity, or personal recommendations. Helping someone else get a job does. It’s a far better investment.

That’s not to say you should help someone get a job just so they’ll help you get a job. My point is that helping others is a shared experience that fosters sharing help.

People are often confused about what good networking is and how to do it. Shared experiences are the most powerful component of good networking. In your case, your buddy just had a great experience with you. Now your network bond is stronger. The recruiter you spoke with had a very valuable experience with you and will think of you when looking for more good candidates — not just referrals, but perhaps to place you.

More resources
Referrals: How to gift someone a job (and why)
Networking For Introverts: How to say it

If you call your buddy or the recruiter in a few months and tell them you’re looking to make a change, do you think they might be the personal referral that gets you your next job? Or would you rather “network” with a stranger on LinkedIn with whom you’ve got no shared experiences?

Help: Be a network hub

When I started headhunting engineers in Silicon Valley I didn’t know anyone. I asked the senior guy in the office what I should do to be successful. “Spend every dime you can to take engineers to lunch. Get to know them. Make friends. Then introduce the best to one another. Do them that favor, then keep doing it.”

This pivotal practice made me the hub of an ever widening engineering network. I made many introductions that didn’t yield any placement fees. But most of those introductions were shared experiences that created trust and built many solid relationships. When I called these engineers for personal referrals to help me fill assignments I was working on, do you think they trusted me to share their best contacts? Do you think they put in a good word for me?

Don’t know anybody that can help you get a new job? Help somebody else fill a job or get a job by sticking your neck out, by breaking the script, and creating an unexpected shared experience. That’s how to tap into a new network. That’s what creates new and valuable personal contacts for you, too.

How have you helped someone get a job? How did you go the extra mile? How did you “say it” when you made a successful personal referral? Did it pay off indirectly for you? Has anyone ever made a special effort to help you get a job?

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How I negotiate a good job offer

On March 29, 2021
How I negotiate a good job offer

Question

Last week you taught us how to negotiate. But, how do you do it for your candidates? How do you make sure they get the best offers possible? I realize it’s probably different because you’re “the middle man,” but I just want to see what I can learn from how you do it.

Nick’s Reply

good job offerA headhunter is paid by an employer (the client) to find and deliver the best candidates for a job. That creates a fiduciary duty. However, I still have a duty to my job candidates. Lots of headhunters fall prey to the misconception that they’re in the full employ of their clients; that they owe the client all information about the candidates; and that given a choice whether to serve the client’s or candidate’s interests, the client always comes first. I think that’s a mistake. The headhunter’s job is to balance the two and do right by both: get a good candidate for the employer and a good job offer for the candidate.

Where a good job offer comes from

I’ve placed candidates with my clients for enormous salary increases by not disclosing the candidate’s current salary. All that matters is that I know both parties are in the same salary ballpark. Why would I want the candidate’s old salary to be the anchor point for negotiations? While I want my client to get a great employee for a fair price so the client will be happy and give me more assignments, I also want the person I place to be happy — and a good source of more candidate referrals! The key, of course, is that the candidate must be worth it.

Therefore, as a sort of mediator, I do my best to juggle information judiciously for everyone’s benefit. I never lie, but I may withhold information that I believe could unreasonably jeopardize the chances of a good match. In the end, the employer and the candidate always make the choice about a job offer. My job is to help them do it.

My favorite negotiating experience was some time ago, when high five-figure compensation packages were not common. A very talented man — let’s call him Alan — was working for a big financial publisher. Alan was bored and, though he didn’t fully realize it, quite underpaid. I asked how much it would take for him to make a move if he liked a job I presented. He gave me a salary range. I’ll tell you what it was shortly.

Make a great match before the interview

My client, a financial services company, needed someone to manage content for their nascent (at the time) website. The salary range on the job was between $65,000-$70,000 — a lot of money at the time.

I discussed Alan with them and mapped his skills, experience and credentials to the objectives of the job. When they asked his current salary, I said, “Well, you need A, B and C done in this job, right? So, when you interview him, satisfy yourselves that he can do A, B and C. But then, also ask him about D, E and F which, though I know is not part of this job, could be very valuable to you, too.”

Then I set the anchor — the point from which we would negotiate: “I’m not going to disclose what he’s making now. What really matters is that he can do all we’ve discussed. That’s why his desired salary range is between $70,000-$75,000.”

I made certain they would consider going higher than their budget for an exceptional match.

Control the information

Only I knew what both sides wanted. I never play games with the question about the ballpark. I don’t like wasting anyone’s time — especially mine! We were in the ballpark.

It’s not just about the salary
“It’s imprudent to take a job without knowing ‘the rest of the story.’ Politely insist on meeting your future boss and the team, as well as others that you will interface with on the job. This includes people who will work directly with you, people who work upstream and downstream from your job, and people in other departments who will influence your ability to succeed at your job.”
From Fearless Job Hunting, Book 9: Be The Master of Job Offers, pp. 31-33

They interviewed Alan and he wowed everyone. I let him know their reaction.

“Okay,” I said. “I’m going to discuss an offer with them. Now I need your permission to negotiate for you. If I can get at least as much as you said you want, can I tell them you’ll take the job? This gives me huge negotiating leverage because it eliminates uncertainty. Okay if I do that?”

Alan enthusiastically said that if they made an offer like that, I could tell them he would accept.

My client asked what I thought it would take to get Alan on board. What they were really asking was, how much will get us all to YES without further ado? I suggested $77,000.

“For a bit more than we originally discussed, you’re showing him how impressed you really are, and that you really want him. If you offer $77,000, I can assure you he’ll accept and be very highly motivated to start the job. No need for further discussion.”

Cause for joy

They made the offer at $77,000. When I conveyed it to Alan, he was shocked and overjoyed. He accepted on the spot. A year later he and his wife thanked me for getting them the down payment for a new house. (One of the most satisfying aspects of my job is changing people’s lives for the better.)

The company’s joy was more practical. They were accustomed to protracted salary negotiations that didn’t always go well. They often had to move on to their second-best candidate. They were happy to get their first choice and relieved there were no surprises. They knew from the start, within a few dollars, what it would cost to fill a key job with the right person. And the day Alan reported for work, the hiring manager could plainly see this guy was pleased and highly motivated to start the job.

A good match makes a good job offer

When I first asked Alan what it would take to entice him to move, he said very firmly, “I’d like to get between $50,000-$55,000.” All I told him was that we were in the right ballpark. If I had told him the actual range for the job, it was possible he’d panic and question his abilities and the demands of the position as reflected in the high salary. I don’t think he would have interviewed as confidently.

My client to this day doesn’t know Alan’s prior salary: $44,000. He started the new job enthusiastically with a 75% increase over what he had been making. He immediately demonstrated he was a stellar performer. My client felt they had scored big. And the truth is, they had, because I could have placed him with their competitor for about as much. He was worth it.

I knew I had a good match from the start. I knew what the client needed. I found a candidate who could deliver it and more. I made the match for a salary the employer felt was fair. And I got Alan a very good job offer that reflected his actual value.

What headhunters get paid for

The lesson here is not that yours truly is a brilliant negotiator. What I did was very simple, and it started with the most important factor in any negotiation for a job: You must know what the employer needs and will pay for, and you must know that your candidate can do it.

This is what the headhunter earns a big fee for: arranging a good match before the two parties meet. This is why the best headhunters have a much higher success rate than job hunters and employers do on their own. We get paid to avoid the huge failure rates of job ads, resumes, job boards, applicant tracking systems and HR departments. We make sure all candidates we submit for a position are very likely to be hired.

The next factor is, Control the information.

This doesn’t mean manipulate everyone. It means my goal is to help both parties avoid crashing the deal because they’re distracted by the wrong issues. I want them to focus on whether there’s a good match first — not on money. This is why I settle the question about money in advance. Roughly how much will each side be happy with?

Then I cut money out of the process until we confirm the match. As long as I know everyone’s in the same ballpark, and exactly what it would take for each party to make a deal, they don’t need to know everything. This lets them focus on the match.

The final factor is joy. Yup — joy. I want my candidate and my client to feel joy at making a good match at a price that we already know they’ll be very happy with. If everyone is happy and feels they got a good deal, I get more search assignments from my client and more candidate referrals from the candidate I just placed. That gives me joy!

You’re not a headhunter, but…

What does this mean to you when you negotiate? You’re not a headhunter or intermediary, but you can negotiate a good job offer like a headhunter if you consider these three rules that keep everyone focused on making a good deal:

Interview only for jobs that you know are a great match. This is absolutely key. It means investing the time to understand exactly what an employer needs and being ready to show you can do the job, right there in the interview. Don’t waste your time on lots of jobs just because there are millions on the Internet. More is not better! Interview only for the right jobs and your offer rate will go way up.

Control the information. Don’t disclose your salary history. Do find out what the salary range for the job is before you apply or interview. If it isn’t in your ballpark, walk away. Know what you want and stick to it. Don’t talk yourself into interviews where you think you “might be able to get them to go higher.”

Deliver joy. Yah, I know that sounds like mushy marketing talk. Do you think the object of your affections would agree to marry you if you didn’t create joy between you? You’ll negotiate the best offer if you can show the employer that you’re who they’ve been waiting for. Do what the headhunter does: Make sure there’s a good match before the interview happens. Surprise the employer by being the candidate who’s worth the money!

You can’t really negotiate like a headhunter because, as you point out, you’re not an intermediary. But you’ll be able to negotiate the best offers possible if you can demonstrate you’re the best possible job candidate. This means you cannot apply for loads of jobs just because some high-failure-rate job board lets you. More is not better!

What parts of my method of negotiating a good job offer could you put to good use? Do you have any techniques you’ve used to optimize job offers? Or, how have you blundered during a job offer negotiation? What else would you like to know about making a good match and a good offer?

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Salary Negotiation: How much to ask for

On March 22, 2021
Salary Negotiation: How much to ask for

Question

salary negotiationWe’re told that whoever mentions a number first in a salary negotiation loses. When employers also demand to know our current salary, that just makes matters worse. So what are we supposed to do in a job interview when this comes up? How do we know how much to ask for and when to do it?

Nick’s Reply

This question came up in a Zoom workshop I did today for about 50 job seekers in a professional group in New Jersey. It triggered a wild discussion. It was great! And I think it’s worth having our own discussion about this important topic here.

I’ll start!

The silly salary negotiation myth

The myth that “whoever says a number first in a salary negotiation loses” has become penny-ante advice served by self-anointed negotiation experts and career coaches who feel safe telling you “it’s best not to say or do anything!”

That’s bunk. Researchers in behavioral economics give us clear guidance from their work on the anchor effect. To wit:

“A well-known cognitive bias in negotiation, anchoring is the tendency to give too much weight to the first number put on the table and then inadequately adjust from that starting point…”

What this essentially tells us is that whoever puts the first number out there can effectively control the final number agreed upon. That Harvard Law School reference isn’t much fun to read. If you’re serious about negotiating, please study William Poundstone’s excellent (and very readable) Priceless: The Myth of Fair Value (and How to Take Advantage of It).

Then read Predictably Irrational by the brilliant behavioral economist Dan Ariely. Don’t fall victim to old wives’ (or husbands’) tales about who goes first. Who wins is who knows what they want and takes control of the negotiation immediately.

Why salary is called compensation

In the rush to negotiate the best deal possible, job hunters every day forget what they’re negotiating for. You’re not negotiating money. You’re negotiating the price of freedom to do the job without distraction.

The money and benefits a company bestows on you in exchange for your services should completely free you from worry about the demands of your personal life so that you can devote your time to, and focus your energy on, the work the employer needs you to do.

Literally speaking, a good job offer should “relieve, equalize or neutralize… pressure or stress” associated with any aspect of your life that might distract you from the job. That’s what compensation means.

It matters that you’re earning what you’re worth and that you’re earning all you can. But, a good job offer starts with a company taking care of your needs so you can take care of its needs. It ensures that the employer has a healthy worker. That’s the foundation of a good deal. And that’s why it’s called compensation. (A living wage is fundamental to commerce. It’s why I take the position that a healthy national minimum wage is so important.)

How to decide how much you want

So, how much salary, or pay, or compensation do you tell an employer you want?

Once we understand the anchor effect, we want to make our stated desired salary as high as possible — without jeopardizing a job offer altogether, if we can help it. We want to make our number the anchor for negotiating.

It’s important to have an idea of how much money you’re worth when considering a particular job. But, it’s also important to know how much you want. This is a very personal decision.

Few things are more painful than accepting an offer only to realize that you were wrong about what you really wanted. I have a simple method to help a job candidate understand what they want with regard to pay.

Consider the specific job at hand and ask yourself three questions, so that you’ll have three ascending figures to work with:

  1. What is the least amount of money I would accept to take this job?
  2. What kind of an offer would put a smile on my face and make me happy to take the job?
  3. How much money would make me jump up and down with glee, and make me want to start work tomorrow? (Caution: this last figure must be reasonable.)

Don’t take the job unless you can negotiate the offer to somewhere between (2) and (3). If an offer isn’t going to at least make you happy (2), it’s not worth accepting. If it doesn’t come close to making you jump with glee (3), the job probably won’t, either.

Express this number as a range so you’ll have wiggle room. You might even note to the employer that if you learn during your interviews that the actual job turns out to be materially more involved or demanding than what they expressed, then your range may change, too.

Finally, ask them whether that’s in their range, and whether they want to proceed with serious discussions about working together —- that is, a complete job interview. It’s actually best to point out that since you’ve disclosed what you want, you’d like to know what their salary range is for the job. But most employers won’t tell you.

Who wears the negotiating pants?

Employers could save themselves a lot of time and trouble by setting a realistic anchor when they post a job. They should post the salary range with it! Why is it a secret anyway? In my experience, most of them are surprisingly naïve. They believe they really might get a bargain because they’re such good negotiators! They’d do better to invest time with candidates that know the salary range in advance. That’s right: A smart employer will set the anchor point first!

Now for the put-on-your-big-boy-or-girl-pants. Two things.

First, if you’re afraid that naming a salary range will put you at risk of getting a lower offer than the employer is willing to pay, let me put your mind at ease. It is highly unlikely that the employer will hear your range and smirk to themselves, “Wow! What a fool! We were going to offer double that! We’ll save a ton!”

It doesn’t happen. At worst you might leave a few dollars on the table. Chump change compared to the salary. If  you want to wear the pants in a negotiation, take control of the terms immediately.

Second, the far greater risk is letting them set the anchor. That is, you state no range at all and then the employer makes a low offer after you have invested hours and hours talking with them. Now you’re forced to negotiate from a lower number.

Salary Negotiation: Know what you want and say it

If you don’t establish that anchor before the interviews start, don’t be surprised when the employer sets the anchor with the job offer. Oh, you can negotiate. But unless you are a truly stellar candidate, the final offer is not likely to be much higher.

Know what you want. Don’t be afraid to set the anchor. And be ready to hitch up your pants and walk away if the offer is not what you want — or more.

How do you negotiate compensation? At what point do you make clear what you want? What makes you walk away from an interview or a job offer? Has anyone ever told you it’s crass or unprofessional to bring money up “too soon?” Has an employer ever told you that “your concern about money reveals that you care more about money than about the job and our company?”

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Does Human Resources go too far?

On March 15, 2021
Does Human Resources go too far?

Question

human resourcesI am so glad someone has finally called out the Human Resources (HR) department on its disrespect for job applicants. The sentiment seems to be that they can waste your time and keep you on hold indefinitely simply because — after all — a job hunter has nothing better to do. You’re unemployed (maybe) or in any event you have come to their company to be emotionally abused.

I am both surprised and appalled at companies that supposedly pride themselves on “great customer service” and then treat job applicants like simpletons. Don’t they realize those applicants are potential customers and can influence other potential customers and every other individual who will listen to the horror story of how poorly the applicant was treated by the company?

Sorry for venting, but I’ve got a few bones to pick. An HR manager just handed me a “dispute resolution agreement” that she requires me to sign before even considering me for a job. I am not questioning the legality of this screening method. I am asking your opinion of what type of company would demand this from an applicant even before an offer is made?

Then there are all the other types of corporate coercion that job seekers put up with, including credit checks, background checks, and other invasions of privacy, when no job offer has even been made. What happens to those credit reports and background summaries that companies require? This material stays on file. Who has access to it, and who is maintaining security?

If I am being hysterical needlessly, please let me know. In any event, I think it’s time someone addressed the invasion of privacy that applicants are subjected to.

Nick’s Reply

Gee, you’re opening a can of worms, aren’t you? My compliments. I’d love to hear from employers on this subject.

Human Resources screening job applicants

You raise good questions about Human Resources practices in screening job applicants. The problem is, companies will do all sorts of things to a job candidate if they’re permitted. As you point out, the poking and prodding is all the more bizarre because employers do it before even making a bona fide offer.

I can understand a “contingent offer,” where a company makes an offer first, and the checks and tests are done after the company has put its money where its mouth is. If the applicant declines the checks and tests, the offer is withdrawn. But to demand so much before offering anything is ludicrous — yet it’s done all the time. (Employers will explain that this approach saves them time and money. But what of the candidate’s privacy if an offer isn’t extended after the kimono is opened?)

Companies are relatively free (until someone stops them) to ask job applicants to do cartwheels, pee in a cup, submit to a background check, expose your credit record, or take a cut in pay for a new job. But the decision — really – is yours.

Question authority

What to do about all this? Question authority. Voice your opinion and decline whatever you don’t want to do. Perhaps more important, consider what it would be like to work for a company that wants you to sign a dispute resolution agreement in advance of a job interview. Why would you sign a “condition of employment” before you’ve seen the enticement of a job offer?

Are you worried about who will see your confidential credit report if you agree to release it, or the background check? Say so, and ask the company to sign an indemnification agreement stipulating what will happen if the company divulges your information to the wrong people. Talk to your attorney if necessary.

If a company can’t justify — to your satisfaction — a requirement of its applicant screening process, it’s your right and responsibility to walk.

Where do Human Resources screening practices come from?

The most honorable companies are doing nothing more than trying to protect themselves. You should do the same. In many cases you will find that the Human Resources department’s requirements are somewhat arbitrary and management has little idea what’s going on.

Why do employers do this stuff, especially in an economy where it’s hard to find and hire the right talent?

HR screening practices are often adopted from “advisory publications” that are circulated among companies by industry associations and “HR consultancies.” HR departments frequently adopt these without much consideration for their impact. I sometimes wonder how much an engineering or marketing department knows about the hurdles HR has set up for hard-to-find applicants. Do department managers realize they may be losing good candidates because of unreasonable and presumptuous application policies?

Talk to the decision maker, then decide

My advice is this: Make sure the decision maker — the person you would report to — understands what HR is doing and how you feel about it. The manager’s response will tell you whether HR’s presumptuous attitude is pervasive. But you may have to make a judgment and a choice. Then you can decide, do you go along, or do you walk? (Remember that if you go along, you may have to live with these people a long time.)

It’s important to note that not all HR people (and policies) are inconsiderate of job candidates. A good HR person will serve as an advocate of both the company’s interests and the candidate’s.

I’ll never forget the seasoned HR representative who stood up to make this very point in front of her company’s entire HR team in a workshop I was conducting. A junior HR rep had just upbraided me for saying essentially what I’ve written here. The seasoned HR person announced that in her 27 years on the job she never asked applicants to fill out forms in advance of an interview — even though failure to do so violated company policy. “It’s rude and it gives candidates the wrong message,” she said. “They are our guests and I treat them that way. If we need forms to be filled out, I do it after the interview process reveals mutual interest.”

Does HR have anything to say?

I don’t think you’re being hysterical at all. You’re calling HR out. Some HR folks may have good reasons for their application policies. My question is, do they really understand the implications of these policies out in the professional communities they recruit from? Especially in these times when employers cry they can’t get the talent they need?

I invite HR and other managers to comment.

Use your judgment before you agree to anything during the job application process. Keep your standards high and let others know you expect them to do the same. Avoid people and organizations that don’t.

[Note: This column appeared in different form in Fearless Job Hunting. It summarizes several complaints I’ve received from job seekers — and my advice remains the same.]

Have a story about how HR went too far when “screening” you for a job? Did you feel coerced? Did you give in? What was the outcome? What can job seekers do to get more respect from HR?

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